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Replacement Slide Research/Interesting source

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  • Replacement Slide Research/Interesting source

    A buddy got an absolutely beautiful rebuild service grade from CMP. It looks immaculate. Ithaca frame and TZ slide, not sure on barrel yet but a chromed replacement.

    I am trying to answer some basic questions. How do we know TZ is Israeli? When were these procured?

    Before you tell me to use the search bar, I did. There are a plethora of posts on these slides. They are apparently Israel but I can’t find a source noting how we know that yet. They were made in the 1960s. Or the 1970s. Or the 1980s. Or all. Depends what post you read. I never see a source though - but I could have missed it.

    I started digging as much as I can on an iphone. My eyes were opened a bit as to why we see so many replacement slides via this document:

    I’m still trying to locate contracts, articles, anything on when and where the slides are from. Any thoughts? If I missed where this is noted with actual sources let me know! If it is in a Clawson type book - did he note a source?

  • #2
    If you search the internet, you will find several references to TZ being a manufacturer code for IMI, but I couldn't find any direct citation. Maybe it is buried somewhere deep in some military purchase records.

    7790314 is the slide drawing number.

    Here is a list of manufacturer cage codes I found on another site

    6K223 Y L A R MFG INC WEST JORDAN, UT 84084-4997
    2U894 A DSE INC VENICE, FL 34292
    26584 F MKB MFG CORP DEER PARK, NY 11729-7203
    Last edited by BSAGuy; 04-02-2023, 07:28 AM.
    Be Prepared


    • #3
      Here ya go...

      Give 'em a call, e-mail 'em, snail mail 'em, or fill out the contact form:

      Dion D. Rode


      • #4
        Originally posted by DDRode View Post
        Here ya go...

        Give 'em a call, e-mail 'em, snail mail 'em, or fill out the contact form:

        🤣🤣🤣. Love it. Yeah I’d like to see a sealed package or copy of anything to show TZ is Israeli contract. It may well be, but there are a lot of “corrected” weapons out there based on erroneous info. I started to wonder when all I see are years of forum posts based on forum posts. Either way - those slides are awesome. In my opinion of course🍻


        • #5
          Hi I also received an Ithaca frame with a "TZ" slide and a "TZ" bbl in the 3rd round. My pistol of course was completely reparked to a beautiful dark blue color and was in 99.5% shape. The bbl was lined and perfect. This pistol most likely sat in a box for the last few years and was not issued. The pistol was manufactured in May/June, 1945 and shipped to San Antonio Arsenal. My Army FOIAS were interesting and still waiting for information from RIA and Navy FOIAS. This one shoots wonderfully and has really been around the horn. I had hoped, of course, for matching slide & frame but am satisfied because of condition. If only early records were available !!!!!!!!!!
          Last edited by gunnyarlow12; 04-02-2023, 01:32 PM.


          • #6
            TZ is a well known and accepted cartridge headstamp code attributed to IMI.

            IMO, case closed

            Premier cartridge collecting site covering all types and forms of ammunition and their history, manufacture, markings and variations
            ID is not my rifle's s/n


            • #7
              Originally posted by 2761377 View Post
              TZ is a well known and accepted cartridge headstamp code attributed to IMI.

              IMO, case closed

              Well known and accepted to cartridge experts/collectors/observers maybe, but apparently not common enough for my advanced armchair google-fu. Excellent link and I thank you, sir. What kind of beer would you like?


              • #8
                Guess I missed these threads...



                Dion D. Rode
                US NAVY/US ARMY(RET)


                • #9
                  From another forum:

                  Here is a list of 1911A1 gov't procurements from Haystack:

                  1911A1 USGI barrels from Jun1978 to Aug 1989:

                  DAAA0989C0736 0001AC 9V970 AMCCOM Aug 1, 1989 $20.1667 12,000 $242,000.40
                  DAAA0989C0736 0001AC 9V970 AMCCOM Aug 1, 1989 $20.2917 12,000 $243,500.40
                  DAAA0989C0736 0001AC 9V970 AMCCOM Aug 1, 1989 $20.5000 12,000 $246,000.00
                  DAAA0984C0390 0001AD 9V970 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $19.4300 9,409 $182,816.87
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AB 0S2G7 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $19.1286 21,000 $401,700.60
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AB 9V970 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $19.1286 21,000 $401,700.60
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AB 9V970 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $19.1500 21,000 $402,150.00
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AB 9V970 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $19.3967 21,000 $407,330.70
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AB 9V970 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $19.4300 21,000 $408,030.00
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AD 0S2G7 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $18.0137 9,809 $176,696.38
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AD 0S2G7 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $18.0902 9,809 $177,446.77
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AD 9V970 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $18.9783 9,409 $178,566.82
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AD 9V970 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $19.4300 9,409 $182,816.87
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AD 9V970 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $18.0902 9,809 $177,446.77
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AD 9V970 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $18.1463 9,809 $177,997.06
                  DAAA0989C0034 0001AD 9V970 AMCCOM Nov 1, 1988 $18.9783 9,809 $186,158.14
                  DAAA0984C0370 0001AB S3140 CCOM Mar 1, 1984 $21.8800 72,000 $1,575,360.00
                  DAAA0984C0390 0001AB 73677 CCOM Mar 1, 1984 $41.6074 19,006 $790,790.24
                  DAAA0980C4646 0001AB 73677 CCOM May 1, 1980 $29.7008 16,295 $483,974.54
                  DAAA0980C4646 0001AC 73677 CCOM May 1, 1980 $29.8953 10,543 $315,186.15
                  DAAA0980C4646 0001AD 73677 CCOM May 1, 1980 $29.5455 6,296 $186,018.47
                  DAAA0980C4646 0001AE 73677 CCOM May 1, 1980 $26.7302 453 $12,108.78
                  DAAA0979C4634 0001AB 55085 CCOM Mar 1, 1979 $27.3226 24,094 $658,310.72
                  DAAA0979C4634 0001AC 55085 CCOM Mar 1, 1979 $27.2983 3,510 $95,817.03
                  DAAA0979C4634 0001AD 55085 CCOM Mar 1, 1979 $27.3267 3,437 $93,921.87
                  DAAA0978C4794 0001AB 26584 AMCCOM Jun 1, 1978 $21.3527 7,769 $165,889.13

                  55085 GEN II Research Inc., Amityville, NY
                  73677 Duroyd Mfg. Co. Inc of NY
                  26584 MKB Mfg. Corp., Deer Park, NY
                  S3140 I.M.I. Ltd., Ramat Hasharon, Isreal
                  9V970 / 0S2G7 National Aerospace Inc., Daytona Beach,

                  Another rabbit hole:


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by PloughMud View Post
                    Well known and accepted to cartridge experts/collectors/observers maybe, but apparently not common enough for my advanced armchair google-fu. Excellent link and I thank you, sir. What kind of beer would you like?
                    please forgive my know-it-all ism

                    first saw that headstamp on a .50 BMG case I souvenired off the deck of U.S.S. Oldendorf in 1993. my wife's cousin had invited us on a Dependents' Day cruise. at that time I only knew of LC and WCC so it aroused my curiosity. it took years to figure it out, at a gunshow.

                    thanks for the offer. after my wife, the best thing to happen to me was to secure from that activity. appreciate the intention, though.
                    ID is not my rifle's s/n


                    • #11
                      If I didn’t fat finger my calculator, that’s 381,675 new slides from that page above.


                      • #12
                        It shows how prone to breakage the WW2 slides are. Some described the metal as soft , which must be an exaggeration. They were designed to go 5,000 rounds. Modern slides go a lot longer. I know folks who have worn out pistol barrels at 30,000 rounds and are on their 3rd barrel , but the slides on their pistols are fine.


                        • #13
                          I think that’s 381,675 new barrels, says 1911A1 USGI barrels from Jun1978 to Aug 1989 at the top of the page.


                          • #14
                            In all the units I've served in during 30 yrs active duty, never did a 1911 have a slide failure. Most were rebuilt pistols but all had GI slides on them. Granted, slides must have needed replacing as the TZZ slides were installed at some point in time but in 1989 when my unit had to turn it its 1911's for the new M9 , all 1911 in our arms room were pure USGI pistols (sum of parts ). 5000 round life of a slide...LOL, any SF team in our battalion racked that many rounds in 3 months time. We shot these pistols hard and long. M9...had cracked slides about 6200 rds and that took most teams only 4 months to bring that to occur. These were early M9's so all were recalled and modifications put in place.


                            • #15
                              I agree. Barrels. Not Slides.